tv CNN Newsroom With Brooke Baldwin CNN January 16, 2015 12:00pm-1:01pm PST
extremists who are depending, depending on who you ask, muslims or islamists posing as muslims. >> what do you think about his language? >> that's entirely true that the extremist is islam. issue is those things are happening. i want to point out under sharia law, a lot of women don't have freedoms. the thing i want to draw attention to the pc police political correctness people say there's a war on women going on. why weren't they here saying something about sharia law and how they're restrictive of women's freedoms under that? that's entirely. that's not the extremist islam. that's all islam under sharia law. while his comments were controversial to some they shed light on there isn't freedom for all for islam. this is muslims prayer but not
allowing the lord's prayer to be said on campus. i'm sure the pc police would come out for. that it seems unbalanced on that campus. it's something, yes they can feel free to pray exercise religion just as christian students should be able to. this seems absolutely unfair top me that they would allow this to happen every friday and have it be broadcast from the special bell tower on campus. >> all right harris i want you to respond to that. >> absolutely. this is exactly the conversation we need to have. this conversation about islam needs to be in the public square because of this rhetoric about what sharia law is and is not. >> tell me how i as a woman shouldn't be offended? >> i respect you ashley. i didn't cut you off at all. >> thank you. >> when people say sharia law is oppressive to women, i invite you to read the entire chapter. i dedicate my book on sharia law. we push back and confront governments.
i call out franklin graham and welcome a public debate to talk about what sharia law. does islam advocate for religion of women? let's have this dialogue. i asked mr. graham to meet in the public square to have this rational dialogue around what is sharia. we're not asking sharia to take over the u.s. constitution. we're asking for separation of religion of state. sharia is not meant to be legislative as government. we oppose saudi arabia sudan, afghanistan, what iran does on oppression to women. we oppose that. we're you're partners not your enemies. >> that's great to hear but would you support the lord's prayer said on campus every day or every friday? >> if duke university allows muslims to have call to pray i asked jews light the candle every time they like to have the
bell before and after service every sunday like they're ready to. all the christians services they already offer, please continue that. >> great. do you think -- >> all right my friends, i'm afraid we're going to have to leave the conversation there. i know you could debate this for hours. >> all day. >> appreciate you being here ashley pratte and harris. >> thank you. >> thank you so much. hello everyone. i'm john berman live in paris. antiterrorists operations sweeping across europe. we're getting reports of raids and terror arrests. antiterrorism police stormed sleeper cells. we just learned the u.s. intelligence community had been a aware of the terrorist plot in belgium for weeks and had shared critical information. we're also learning today that two people were caught many a tunnel trying to cross from france to italy.
belgium is asking for their extradition extradition. both men are thought to be part of the jihadi cell in verviers where anti-terror raids killed two yesterday. belgium police fearing an attack raided cells in belgium and france. they made a total of 17 arrests. while that's going on an 18-year-old woman was arrested at the airport outside london. she's held on suspicion of quote preparation of terrorist acts. here in france the terror is widening. two were arrested near paris overnight, all connected to the shooting at the supermarket, all connected to amedy coulibaly, the man that killed four french jews at the market. and a policewoman. i want to get to phil black in the city of verviers. we just got information u.s. knew about something of this terrorist plot in the city where two people were killed.
interesting to know the u.s. knew about it. belgium fishofficials seemed to know for weeks as well. >> reporter: that's what belgium authorities have been saying the last 24 hours or so. they've been monitoring this group for some time. they haven't said specifically but implied it's been weeks, predating the attacks in paris, and that it was some piece of information. they haven't said which specifically triggered widespread raids, most dramatic took place behind me. this was stormed by police. it's where they engaged in an intense fire fight with two terror suspects. two of which were killed and a third injured and taken to custody. it's here police say they found compelling evidence of the plot they believe they have disrupted. heavy weaponry ak 47s, other weapons and explosives police
uniforms and a large sum of money. all of this supports their theory the plot was designed to attack a police officers in the street or police stations. the raid one of 12 across this country. 13 arrests here in belgium. you mentioned those two in france. there are two in france. four belgium nationals in cust custody. authorities say this is the result of an investigation going on some time one that does predate the events in paris. they're also keen to make the point this is not part of a wider european crack down very much a belgian specific operation john. >> reporter: belgium specific operation. though there had been arrests in france with connection to hit and france into italy with
connection. tentacles spread across the country. you heard from belgian officials overnight they didn't want to tell us too much about this operation. barbara starr said the same thing. officials didn't want to say too much about how the u.s. knew about these attacks perhaps because they're still developing intelligence and still ongoing operations happening now or planned for the near future. >> reporter: it's pretty clear the authorities are not convinced of terror threat is gone from this country at all. you're right. they're being tight lipped. details they've given so far have been limited. they have not told us just what piece of information it was that led them to launch the operations that we've seen. they're not giving a specific time frame on just how long this investigation has been running. now from the belgian government we are hearing about significant
steps designed to insure the ongoing security of this country. they're deploying 150 soldiers to sites to be determined by the belgian government. those they believe are possibly sensitive. they've raised the terror alert to the second highest level in the last 24 hours. all sounds do indicate they believe there's still a threat. they're not giving away a lot of details just yet on the plot they believe they have disrupted. john? >> reporter: telling law enforcement officers to be careful of social media presence and telling them to be armed even when off duty. precautions taken around that nation. phil black in verviers thank you so much. brianna back to you. >> thanks john. could the west be feeling this? it's estimated 3400 western perers
have gong to join jihad. 8 germany 550, britain 500 and u.s. 150. with me now to talk about this we have cnn global affairs analyst bobby and also the managing editor. this is the question bobby i think. what can the u.s. really do i guess to identify people who have gone abroad maybe to turkey presumably to syria and coming back. what can the u.s. and european nations that arguably have a bigger problem than the u.s. to really make sure that those people don't plan attacks here? >> it's a little easier for the u.s. than europeans. europeans have borders that's easily to slip from one country to the other. from the last european countries in the east to slip into turkey.
it's easier. not easy but easier. for the u.s. you have to cross an ocean, take a long distance flight which means much more likelihood there will be alarms that go off and you'll be caught or at least authorities here will know you've gone and come back and then begin to decide whether it's worth pursuing you or not, worth keeping track of you. if you have 150 people presumably scattered around the country, to keep a 24 watch on any one person takes 15 to 25 30 law enforcement officers. that's a lot of commitment. it's hard to keep that kind of commitment for each every one of these people. decisions have to be made. >> is there a way to sort someone that might be of greater risk that someone who isn't? if someone has come back from syria, do they all fall in the same risk pot? >> they start in the same pot and depending on their behavior and conversation they have and
depending on how their movements, depending on presumably their e-mail and phone conversations. some kind of process of elimination can be made and determination can be made about who's more dangerous and who'slesswho's less. we've heard from the kouachi brothers they had been in jail. at some point authorities decided these guys are not dangerous enough to keep constant track of. that shows how risky decisions are. >> what are the risks to u.s. for instance of accepting visiting from yemen where people might be more screened to a larger degree than say someone coming from france or england. do you feel they're screened equally? >> i can tell you my own personal experience no. when i travelled to yemen and
came back i got a much greater degree of scrutiny. when you fill out the form you have to say where you were last. when i travelled to iraq and came back i had a lot of scrutiny. when i went to france or uk not so much. scrutiny is not equal, but we know the kouachi brothers and coulibaly were on a watch list. their actions and activities were not unknown to american law enforcement and agencies. french knew them share had the information, went on no fly list or alert list. they slipped through the net. i shows how difficult the best laid plans can be. >> how many targets there are. >> bobby, thank you so much. appreciate your insight. just a short time ago, president obama saying terrorists are good at recruiting young men through social media. let's hear his comment and head
back to paris. >> reporter: plus a dutch mayor tells muslims to accept. but to get from the old way to the new you'll need the right it infrastructure. from a partner who knows how to make your enterprise more agile, borderless and secure. hp helps business move on all the possibilities of today. and stay ready for everything that is still to come.
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i'm john berman live in paris. europe on edge again this afternoon. anti-terror raids in several locations across europe. an 18-year-old girl apprehended outside london for being involved perhaps in some kind of plot in the terrorism realm in belgium. in france 17 arrests connected to an operational cell in the city of verviers. europe very much on edge. while that is happening here in the united nations, president obama met with the british prime
minister david cameron. terror was on their agenda. i want to bring in jake tapper. thanks so much for being with us this afternoon. jake the views of terrorism in britain and united states both leaders were friendly with each other, thanked each other for all a their support, talked about how old the friendship is. is there a different view of terror now? >> i don't think there's a different view many terms of the threat and terms to combat the threat. they seem to view the world differently, cameron and obama, when it comes to how the would be jihadis is self-radicalized terrorists come to that point in their lives. i want you to take a listen. here is president obama talking about why he think this is problem is more stark in europe than it is now in the united
states. >> our muslim populations, they feel themselves to be americans. there is this incredible process of immigration and assimilation that is part of our tradition that a is probably our greatest strength. it doesn't mean we aren't subject to kinds of tragedies we saw at the boston marathon. that i think has been helpful. there are parts of europe in which that's not the case. that's probably the greatest danger that europe faces. >> no doubt what president obama is describing in terms of assimilation issues is accurate but people in the uk. tony blare when i interviewed him yesterday and current prime minister david cameron when he spoke today, they seem to be cautioning the united states not to view this problem of
self-radicalized islamist terrorists strictly through lens of whether or not they're poor or feel alienated from society. take a listen to the british prime minister cameron today. >> you can have people who have had all advantages of immigration, all economic opportunities our countries offer who still get seduced by this death cult of a narrative. we've seen people who have gone to fight in syria who threaten us at home who have had every opportunity and advantage in life in terms of immigration. let's never lose sight of the real enemy, the poisonous narrative perverting islam. that's what we have to focus on. >> you'll notice john the british prime minister was much more willing to use the word islamic or islamists than president obama was. there is a real difference of
opinion here in terms of how much assimilation how much alien alienation and poverty have to do with this. years ago they were not poor struggling to make a living whatever. they were part of the society. this is a real difference of opinion when it comes to american and british leaders john. >> reporter: jake so glad you brought up this point. it was subtle to some as they were listening, but it's a key distinction and important discussion now. the lead starts at the top of the hour. don't miss it. back to you brianna in new york. strong words from a dutch mayor in the aftermath of the paris terror attacks. quote, if you don't like
democracy democracy, f off. did his comments go too far? plus when sleeper cells awake, how will other cells react in the crack down across europe? stay with us. [cat meows] ♪meow, meow, meow, meow...♪ it's more than just a meal it's meow mix mealtime. with great taste and 100% complete nutrition, it's the only one cats ask for by name. shopping online is as easy as it gets. wouldn't it be great if hiring plumbers, carpenters and even piano tuners were just as simple? thanks to angie's list now it is. we've made hiring anyone from a handyman to a dog walker as simple as a few clicks. buy their services directly at angieslist.com no more calling around. no more hassles. start shopping from a list of top-rated providers today. angie's list is revolutionizing local service again. visit angieslist.com today.
pack your bags and f off. that's the message the mayor of a major dutch city has for unhappy muslims in europe. he was on a dutch news program when asked about the controversy magazine "charlie hebdo." he said quote, if you don't like freedom, for heaven's sake pack your bags and leave. if you don't like because some humorous you don't like are making a newspaper, may i then
say you can f off. joining me is aj former mayor. thanks for joining us. really appreciate it. >> thank you very much brianna. >> you heard what this dutch mayor said. what's your reaction to that? >> brianna, you know i can understand his sentiment, but immigrants coming from all different countries as well as following different religions cannot be characterized and defined by acts of psycho pathic killers. i came to this country looking for freedom, liberty and justice. i found it more so than i found it in the country where i was born. i'm going to do everything in my power to stick by those principles and promote those principles. >> i want to talk to you about some of the terminology we've heard to describe what's
happened in paris -- obviously a lot of muslims reject the idea that they feel these are extremists who are hiding behind islam. the term radical islam is sort of falling out of favor at the white house. they're hosting a forum and calling it violent extremism, not using the term radical islam. what do you think about that? does it make a difference? >> i feel there's a big difference between it. i absolutely agree with it. this is not what the religion teaches us. this is extremism. this has got nothing to do with islam. >> so if you have muslims who obviously don't agree with what's happened they feel this is done sort of by fake muslims if you will. should they be more vocal about trying to explain the difference? is that their responsibility? is that something that makes life better for them or that
furthers understanding, or is that not a responsibility? >> i will completely agree with you. i think it is the responsibility of the muslim people to define themselves and completely separate them from extremist ideas. we all speak for freedom. we come here and ask for freedom and freedom of speech and writing. i think we should stick to those principles completely. >> can you talk -- sorry go on. i was going to say i do want you to touch upon any personal experiences you've had whether from the time when you were younger or as an adult experiences that you may have had with people discriminating against you because of your religion. >> i can tell you that the only thing i can describe is a little bit of concern when i stood in the election on part of certain people who were concerned whether as the mayor of the city
i was going to bring sharia law or build mosques with city funds. i think those concerns were genuine concerns. i relieved those concerns and got elected. >> you relieved those concerns. are some of those concerns annoying to you that you have to sort of say no i'm not going to build mosques with city funds. isn't that sort of frustrating? do you feel it's part of your job to explain it? >> no. i don't find them annoying at all. i don't find them frustrating at all. these are genuine concerns people have. they're simple answers to that. we don't build churches with city funds. we have a good legal system in place. there's no reason to bring another system. we came here looking for the freedom that we enjoy, and we stick with it. >> all right dr. aj. thank you so much for being on the show with us. >> thank you so much. and next the race to find
agencies on high alert. they're trying to assess these growing threats. there have been more than two dozen arrests at this point. 13 of those happened in belgium. that's where police conducted raids that ended with two suspects dead. the arrests raising key questions does the crack down stall them or force their plans to overdrive? does it hurt police investigations if they move in too soon? we have cnn global affairs analyst david rose. this is the question. do you have in this case where some cells have been busted other sleeper cells reacting to that? >> you could. that's what we don't know. the problem is we've known about this for years. thousands of young men from europe were going to syria and finding. hundreds are back. they could be trained to be very disciplined and run cells that are hard to find.
they could be home on their own and inspired to carry out on their own. there's a threat and no formula to deal with all of then. >> they may not all be talking to each other, may not be connected. >> there's a lot of technology the web to incite people. this is classic spy craft. you'll have one cell here and another in a different location. they may not know the other exists. they're designed if one is taken do you think the other can survive. it's hard to track. these groups are changing tactics. they're not calling each other on cell phones and saying anything remotely suspicious. >> how are they talking? >> it's unclear. they could be meeting in person. the raids in belgium, these guys that were killed had assault rifles police uniforms explosives. it's not easy to get these rifles in europe. how did they get these? >> they've been trafficked in obviously.
they have connection to somebody who is a terrorist. are investigators here getting any leads when they go in like we saw in belgium. they bust open a sleeper cell. it should be i think a wealth of knowledge but maybe it isn't. >> it is in terms of people. if they're belgium citizens they can track those down. what they won't know is people they met in syria who have come back and went their separate ways coming from syria. maybe they know french or german jid jihadists. >> could others have slipped through? >> we don't know. clearly flou the lyly now the level of a alert is high. they may want to wait. law enforcement is on edge and ready. they could wait for weeks or months who knows. >> you think these series of
crack downs stalls some of their plans rather than ex pediting their plans? from a law enforcement perspective perspective perspective, what is the risk of getting involved too soon? we heard from the prosecutor that these folks were hours maybe a day or two out from doing something. why not go in sooner? >> well you want to wait. they often try to get informants into the cell. that's the best way to get intelligence to get the names, the plans, who's supplying them who's funding them. so traditionally law enforcement wait as long as they can. this was a dangerous situation, a close call. it was a good sign they stopped the attack clearly. the belgian intelligence service was on top of this. >> what made me feel more comfortable is they had been under surveillance sometimes. it sounds like by the skin on
their chin. that's good news. david, thank you so much. appreciate it. >> thank you. next the say satirical "charlie hebdo" magazine getting slammed by one of its founders. we have that story next. fshz and all your data. cyberedge from aig is more than insurance. it's proactive technology and specialists to help keep you ahead of the curve. claims specialists and advisors to protect you as cyber risks evolve. cyberedge -- to help you change the internet of risk into the internet of opportunity.
. just in to cnn in a big move the supreme court announcing it will tackle the issue of same sex marriage and whether gay couples have the constitutional right to marry or whether states are allowed to ban it. four states petitioned the court. florida becoming the 36th state to allow gay marriage. arguments are expected in april and a ruling expected in june. we'll have more on this coming up. berman back to you. >> reporter: all right thanks so
much brianna. that's a big legal development. here in paris, the editor of "charlie hebdo" was laid to rest today. as his loved ones mourned, the pounder of the magazine where he was killed is slamming the editor. joining me to talk about this senior media correspondent, host of cnn reliable sources, brian. this founder's name is henri roussel. >> he's now 80 years old. in 1970 he was a cofounder of the magazine. he says this editor, the one that died last week was brilliant but stubborn and thought the editor went too far to publish images of muhammad after the offices were fire bombed in 2011. they published others in the future including 2012 et cetera. we saw the cofounder say, what
made him feel the need to drag the team into overdoing it? we have heard the discussion how much is too much and what line should not be crossed when it comes to portrays. >> it's hard to buy that case when you see the surviving staff members even after the death of charb. we went to the news conference where the man that designed the new cover and put muhammad even after the death of charb. >> that's a good point. we heard from staff members quoted in the past saying they knew the risks. now surviving staff members still working on the magazine say they were and aware of the risks that comes with the provocative work they do.
to that point, underscoring that point, we did see protests in a number of locations in the middle east today. we saw a protest turn violent in pakistan. a couple hundred were trying to march toward the consulate and were pushed back and propelled back. a photographer was injured. he worked for a news outlet based in france afp. we don't know if that's a coincidence or not. there's no evidence it was intentionally firing at that photographer because they were for afp. if it's a coincidence, it's awfully disturbing. that person is recovering now from the injuries. >> all right. brian stelter for us. to give an update for those that haven't asked, still can't find an issue of "charlie hebdo" on newsstands sold out everywhere we've looked in paris. >> i can't find one here either.
>> all right. next, to be young. thanks john. next we'll talk about what it's like to be young marginalized and muslim. we'll talk to teenage angst to jihad. stay with us. push your enterprise and you can move the world. ♪ ♪ but to get from the old way to the new you'll need the right it infrastructure. from a partner who knows how to make your enterprise more agile, borderless and secure. hp helps business move on all the possibilities of today. and stay ready for everything that is still to come. e financial noise financial noise financial noise
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the republican party aiming to grab the white house next year has learned from the past the gop has cut the number of primary debates to determine its nominee for president. last go-round 2012 candidates were exhausted after enduring nearly 20 face-offs at the podium. let's bring in cnn politics executive editor mark preston. he is in san diego, where the republican national committee is having its winter meeting. big pow-wow this time of year. tell us about these debates. how many where are they going to be and these cities realize the stage has to be gigantic if the potential field is any indication right? >> no question. at this point we're looking at over more than a dozen republicans. some would say a dozen legitimate republicans who are talking about running for
president. what we have seen here today is a republican national committee, basically the governing board of the whole republican party decided to cut the number of debates down to somewhere between nine and 12. a stark difference in what we saw back in 2012. they did this because of the bloodletting they saw back in 2011-2012, where we had so much interparty fighting. they thought mitt romney went into the general election bruised, battered. he didn't have the money. this is one effort that they are trying to take. now, of the nine to 12 sanctioned debates they did today, cnn is actually going to be hosting three of them. i think you could argue that perhaps the most important one certainly at the beginning is going to be in september, on september 16th at the reagan library. cnn did a debate back in 2008 it was the final debate of the 2008 republican presidential nomination at the reagan library so really a symbolic place for republicans to talk about politics and policy in september. >> there could be more right?
we see nine here but there could be these three more. >> right. no doubt. that's why i say somewhere between nine and 12 nine and 13. the debate process for republicans will start in august. it will happen -- the beginning will happen in ohio where republicans will hold their convention in many ways a symbolic start for the debate process will be where they end and choose their nominee a year later. that will be in ohio. that will extend all the way through the end of february. that gives you nine debates across several different television networks. then we hit march and in march, we have cnn and another television network that is already lined up to do those debates. you could argue at that point that's when the stage will be shrunk. we won't see a dozen candidates. we will probably see just a handful of candidates onstage. those who made it through iowa new hampshire, south carolina and that's when we will start seeing some real real debating going on and probably have a better idea of who is going to be the gop nominee. that will happen in march.
>> do you think that when you're talking about having 12 debates, that still sounds pretty -- it's not 20 but it still sounds like it could be pretty bruising and kind of remind us why it was so tough for mitt romney sort of what the damage was coming out of those 20 debates in 2012. >> there are two lines of thinking is 12 or 20 too many debates or should there be less. if you are a candidate who is not able to raise an incredible amount of money like mitt romney was able to do back in 2011-2012, you would have somebody like rick santorum or newt gingrich who are able to use the debates to get their message out and compare and contrast with the front-runner mitt romney. now, the establishment republicans were very upset by that because they felt like it was unneeded but if you are a grassroots republican you want to see more debates, especially as we head into this next election cycle. as you said at the top, the bottom line right now is we have
at least 12 candidates maybe more who potentially could vie for the republican nomination. just in the last 24 hours, i saw scott walker basically deliver his opening speech for his candidacy. i saw ben carson do that yesterday. right behind me in the next hour we will see rick perry, the texas governor do it. in just a couple of hours, mitt romney who let news leak last week that he is going to run again, will be here in san diego. he is going to speak directly to the rnc members. we are actually going to be able to see his first public comments. >> all right. mark preston getting us ready for what is sure to be a slugfest no matter whether it's 20 or 12 debates. thank you. before we go the obama administration was criticized earlier this week for failing to show up at that huge anti-terror rally in france with other top world leaders, dozens of them. now secretary of state john kerry is in paris making i guess you could say a belated visit. he said in a statement he wanted
to quote, give paris a hug. that big hug, perhaps? it included singer-songwriter james taylor doing a special version of "you've got a friend" for the people of france. let's listen. ♪ you just call out my name ♪ ♪ and you know wherever i am i'll come running to see you again ♪ ♪ winter spring summer or fall ♪ ♪ all you've got to do is call and i'll be there yes i'll be there you've got a friend ♪ ♪ now ain't it good to know
you've got a friend when people can be so cold ♪ >> kind of odd, isn't it? well you know where you've got a friend. that would be a friend in jake tapper. that does it for me. "the lead" with jake tapper starts right now. according to police the terrorists were just hours away from striking but is the countdown to the next attack already running out? i'm jake tapper. this is "the lead." the world lead. last week it was france this week belgium. next week your guess is as good as mine. security forces across europe racing to root out any terrorist cells, a barrage of arrests and raids in belgium, france the uk as officials there say the clock is ticking until more terrorists attack. as europe raises its alert level, new details that the belgians were not the only ones watching this alleged terror